Hones specifics

J

Jgormal94

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24
Location
Glasgow
So basically I read over the sticky on hones, for some reason I'm drawn to the natural stones so I have a few questions.

First of all CAN you get a shave ready edge off a Belgian Coticule, in general I mean?

Re the Scotch hones, how much would you expect to pay for the "Water of Ayr" or "Tam O' Shanter" stones?

And finally, regarding the thuringians which I've seen going for silly money, is this the same thing?
http://www.toolshop.de/Accessories/Honing-Stones/Thuringian-Natural-Whetstone-fine::2057.html?MODsid=06283d942cd396da4c717069c09854ca

Cheers!
 
Yes you can get a great shaving edge from a coticule. It isn't as straight forward as some other hones but if you are prepared to put the time in you will get an edge that is equal to any other stone.

From what I read the modern Thuringians are not as good as the vintage ones but I only have experience of the vintage ones.

Sorry can't help with the Scottish hones.
 
A couple of questions:

- Do you have any honing experience? If no, you might want to consider starting on a synthetic stone of know grit rating.

- What do you want to achieve with hones - everything from bevel set onwards or just a touch-up?

Coticules are an adaptable stone and their fans will tell you they are capable of honing a razor from bevel set. This may be possible but you might find you have a beard before you get there.

If you are after just a finishing hone then you may or may not get that with a coticule - they vary quite a lot and some are fast cutters but not particularly good finishers whereas others are harder and better at finishing. You would need to rely on the honesty and knowledge of the vendor to get a good finisher.

I'm firmly in the camp that says it's better to work with something you know the grit rating of - Naniwas in particular I find to be good finishing stones at 10 or 12k level.

My experience with Coticules - I have two - is that I've never managed to get as good an edge as I can from Naniwas. Now that could be that both mine are poor finishers and I don't pretend to have enough knowledge to say for certain. The point is though, if you buy a coticule because of their famed silky edges but, like me, you find it needs to be sharper - then you end up using pastes such as CrOx and are no longer shaving on a coticule edge.

As for Thuringians - they generally come in quite narrow sizes which is fine when you are an experienced honer - but If you are a beginner then a wider stone is much easier to learn on.

Take a look at the Strop Shop site for prices on stones. Neil sometimes has the Scottish and other types available.
 
Thanks for the feedback Mike.

Rob, I would love to get a Naniwa set from 1k to 12k but at this stage the cost is far too prohibitive. My idea was to use the Coticule on edges which just need a touch up, just to practise the action of honing (which as far as I know, doesn't change - you're just adding slurry into the equation) and then perhaps later on I might get additional stones, such as a 10 or 12k finishing stone, but as it is I'm wanting something that can get me into honing with relatively little up front investment.

Any thoughts on that? Am I just wasting money for an inevitable end goal or is that a viable option?
 
Jgormal94 said:
Thanks for the feedback Mike.

Rob, I would love to get a Naniwa set from 1k to 12k but at this stage the cost is far too prohibitive. My idea was to use the Coticule on edges which just need a touch up, just to practise the action of honing (which as far as I know, doesn't change - you're just adding slurry into the equation) and then perhaps later on I might get additional stones, such as a 10 or 12k finishing stone, but as it is I'm wanting something that can get me into honing with relatively little up front investment.

Any thoughts on that? Am I just wasting money for an inevitable end goal or is that a viable option?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think you are wasting money - and as you say, honing is honing so learning on a coticule is as good as anything in terms of getting muscle memory. The other thing is that they are pretty good second hand value so you would not lose a great deal if you wanted to move it on.

One bit of advice is to go for a reasonable sized rectangular rather than a bout. Bouts can be cheaper but their irregular size can be an issue. I'm sure you are aware of the Coticule Ardennes web site, but if not, they show sizes and prices very clearly.
 
A cheaper option.

1k King http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/KING-Deluxe-Stone-Sharpening-Whetstone-1000-Japan-Japanese-Sharpener-Water-/231142642879

4k & 8k Norton Combo http://theperfectedge.com/?product=norton-48k-waterstone

Then choose a natural finisher of your choice, Coticule, Welsh Slate, Thuri etc.

Then again with practice and persistency you can do it all on a Belgium Blue/Coticule combination stone about the size Mike suggests above. Bevel set to shave ready.
There is a fairly recent thread when I did just that ;)
 
Be sure to let us know how you get on and please ask away if you have any questions, there are a few of us on here who use coticules regularly. I'm a recent convert myself but have somehow ended up with quite a few nice examples and manage to get consistently good results.

Enjoy!
 
So I got my coti the other day and a few razors! Using the unicot method I've managed to get a pretty decent shave. However I definitely feel there's more I can get out of it. Also, it takes FOREVER on the early stages of that method.

What's your sharpening/touch up method on it?
 
Great!

They seem to cut very slowly with water alone so I've found it's important not to jump to plain water too soon. Make sure you have got the max out of the edge with slurry before finishing with plain water otherwise you will just be polishing a dull edge.

If your razor is very dull it will take a while to set the bevel but who's in a hurry? :)
 
So after a few hours of trying to set the bevel on the coti I've bit the bullet and I'm ordering the 1k "King" hone that jaycey posted...

And so it begins.

But before I do that, has anyone ever heard of these?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Master-Class-Combination-Sharpening-Stone/dp/B003ASDAGU/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1428930144&sr=8-4&keywords=king+whetstone
 
mikew said:
Great!

They seem to cut very slowly with water alone so I've found it's important not to jump to plain water too soon. Make sure you have got the max out of the edge with slurry before finishing with plain water otherwise you will just be polishing a dull edge.

If your razor is very dull it will take a while to set the bevel but who's in a hurry? :)
Click to expand...

+1

Also more pressure on the blade and slurry refresh during bevel setting speeds things up a lot
 
As MichaelS says you need to keep refreshing the slurry if you have a lot of work to do. I doubt you'll find a huge difference between a 1K synthetic stone and your coti in terms of speed.
 
Just to add....

A 1K synthetic stone or any synthetic stone will tend to cut quicker than a natural stone but it's all to easy to fall in to the trap of thinking you need just one more stone and that will be the answer to all your problems. Ask me how I know ;)

There are many stones that can be used to hone razors and if you can afford too, then by all means, buy them all! But the most important element to learning this skill is practise and you can't rush that.
 
I bought the king stone, for the low price it was hard to say no. If nothing else it means I won't have to keep refreshing the slurry.

Mike, I can definitely see how this can get out of hand. I have so many hobbies where the correct number of whatever it is, is n + 1; where n is the number you already have. Alternatively s - 1; where s is the number at which your significant other would separate from you.

But yeah, I'm just taking it slowly now. In a few weeks I might have cracked the code with one of my razors...
 
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