Simpson Brushes

You initiated the issue of venues in your post of 23/12 at 1:35pm.

As you rightly say a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing, as I have noticed. I can also accept you do not get on with me, stuff happens; we'll leave it at that shall we, it is Christmas Eve?

I do however wish you well in your 'dream' to re-acquire Simpsons, 'maybe, eh?'

I'm off this post.




Gary Young said:
Blyth Spirit said:
It's been a fascinating read Gary thanks for your memories.

However suites at the Ritz and lunch meetings at the Cafe Royal and all the associated on-costs do have to be paid for and while I accept your rationale about paying for quality products there does have to come a break point when the customer recognises that it is he who is paying for the "gentlemen's" image and the sellers business luxuries not simply buying a shaving brush. Quality is quality not because it is expensive or bespoke (although the two often go hand in hand) but because the price/product/functionality and product longevity tie up. The current and classic example of that mix in shaving brushes is the 404 Badger/Boar mix.
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I must have been mistaken about the section above relating to The Ritz/Cafe Royal. I thought it was included in your post?!?!?

I am glad you have been in your profession for 30 years - an admirable achievement. Because of your longevity in your chosen career I have no doubt that you have experience of 'how these meetings are conducted'. That may be in your world but not in the world that was Simpsons. I am sure you have heard this adage before - 'A little knowledge is a dangerous thing'.

I have enjoyed answering questions on here and replying to private messages but I guess you can't get on with everyone, and I guess I cannot get on with you.
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I am glad that it has been noticed 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing'. For the record, I was taught the brush making business by my father, who was taught by my grandfather, etc, etc. It was a way of life for me, growing up. I learnt how to play a role in the business from my pre-teen years. I learnt how to deal with meeting customers at various levels - an experience which put me in good stead for the career I am in - I work on Heritage Restoration Projects for 'prestige clients' - unless of course anyone on here wants to dispute that English Heritage, The National Trust, Historic Royal Palaces are not prestige. My aptitude for what I do now is due to the knowledge I learnt from 2 great teachers - my Grandfather and my Father.
I did state on here that I would not give the 'biggest' reasons for why we gave up the business as it was a family matter. Well, since my presence is not an enjoyable one on here now ( I joined after a pleasant request from Dipesh), I will say that 2 massive factors in giving the business up were my Grandfathers decline with Parkinson's Disease and my Fathers horrid experience of 2 very major spinal operations - not bad management issues.
Apologies to people on here that have appreciated my input but I am a person at the end of the day with great memories of a fantastic business that was respected across the World. I am not a 'commodity' or just a 'sounding board' on this forum.
 
This turn of events is a real shame, I've enjoyed reading this thread and appreciated the personal and historical perspective Gary has been kindly shared with us.

Thank you Gary, and I hope to catch up with you on the other forum,

Chris
 
A Nice friendly and polite NEW member that was giving us some interesting information and history about Simpsons brushes gone after only three days, not very nice for a new member and doesn't exactly portray TSR in a good light, thought this was a SHAVING forum ?

not going to get many chances to get people like Gary to join us, shame it has turned out like this. :( :oops:

Perhaps we should have given Gary time to settle in and see what we are all about and vice versa....

Too late now

Sorry to see him go

Steve
 
I think things might have been taken a bit more personal than was meant this is of course a forum not a blog, you will get people asking questions and disagreeing with you, thats what makes people different. One person reads a response gives there opinion on business in general (which did not seem like a attack or slur in any way to me) thats what goes on in a forum and in life. If gary did not wont to answer about that part of the business he could have just said and that would have been it, no ill feeling. I dont even think anyone pushed him on the subject really, Anyway.........Turkey :hungrig
 
Agreed we are all entitled to our thoughts and views on everything. Just a shame to see a member go so soon I mean it wasn't even long enough to even give Antdad a chance to upset him !!!

Never mind onwards and upwards
 
I only upset people I don't like. ;)

Shame Gary had a bit of a thin skin, you cannot indulge in your heritage and new found popularity, put yourself up for questioning and then decide some topics are out of bounds.

@Blyth - if you have a shedding brush, Simpson are usually happy to replace it.

Here's my Asprey Chubby 2 - Sharris at the bottom of the page -

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Dipesh said:
Hey Gary, you think I could see a pic of your 'proper' simpsons brushes?

I've never knowingly seen a pic of vintage simpsons brushes before.
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antdad said:
I only upset people I don't like. ;)

Shame Gary had a bit of a thin skin, you cannot indulge in your heritage and new found popularity, put yourself up for questioning and then decide some topics are out of bounds.
4

It's not a case of having 'thin skin' and I was not 'indulging in my new found popularity either! Reading through some of the old threads on here there seems to be a lot of assumption regarding the original Simpson company and set-up. I was asked to join here because you guys would appreciate the inside knowledge from the original days when the family still owned the company - and hopefully provide a soldi answer rather than supposition.
I was entitled to have areas out of bounds, purely because none of you knew the family. I would not be so rude or imposing askign questions about any of your family!! I hope that makes sense and I hope you may be able to understand.
I offered to answer questions about the history of the brushes and the mill.
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As far as I'm concerned, we all have some out of bounds areas, you included. Every man deserves a private side and no-one has to answer questions which they deem to be too personal. We are all our sole judges of "too personal".

Hope we can all appreciate that, and I hope you stick around.
 
I really didn't think anyone asked personal questions about Gary's family. We were naturally interested to understand why the business was sold. This seems to have been due to reduced demand because of a preference among UK customers for cheaper massed produced brushes, a reluctance to change some traditional pratices and finally, ill health of some key people. This must have happened to countless family businesses. Very sad for those involved, but it's the way of the world.

Let's hope during this season of goodwill, Gary will feel able to answer any further questions about the brushes and the mill.
 
Fido said:
I really didn't think anyone asked personal questions about Gary's family. We were naturally interested to understand why the business was sold. This seems to have been due to reduced demand because of a preference among UK customers for cheaper massed produced brushes, a reluctance to change some traditional pratices and finally, ill health of some key people. This must have happened to countless family businesses. Very sad for those involved, but it's the way of the world.

Let's hope during this season of goodwill, Gary will feel able to answer any further questions about the brushes and the mill.
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Second that, as im still trying to discern why any of the posts so far on this thread would result in Gary's latter post.
 
Without reference to Simpsons brushes I can say from wide experience that family-run business often fail because of that mix of private and public.

Some areas are deemed by one member of the staff/family to be "private and personal" (e.g. the state of their health, finances etc) but others may see see it as of public or commercial consequence.

Incompetence also often goes unquestioned (who wants to accuse their dad or brother of not being up to the job?) and I have even seen downright corruption "overlooked" (a blind eye turned to a family member behaving not just unprofessional but illegally and to the detriment of the company).

So (for example) a elder member of the family (and the firm) holds on to power even when his/her health is failing. A young (NOT "Young" - this is is not personal, just an example) member of the family/firm may see this as deleterious to the company's performance or even survival. The older member sees the young 'un getting keen to take the throne and retrenches all the more, refusing to discuss his/her health as it's "private and personal" and of no relevance to the performance of the company. But the failing health means the older member is no longer able to run the show the way he/her once did and so the company's performance is impaired (and maybe even the future of the company itself is imperilled). But the old one won't let go - it's his/her "duty" and indeed, whole life. Besides the young 'uns are seen as ambitious upstarts and not yet ready to take the reigns.

Etc etc.

All very painful and often leads to both a breakdown in family relationship and commercial failure.

I have seen it happen many, many times.

(And yes, I do work for "our Father" and his Son is the MD - but thats the exception.)

I hope none of the issues above were true for Simpsons but I do know that it can be hard for a member of a family-run firm to talk openly, honestly and objectively (especially about failure) precisely because of the mix of the personal and public.

Gary, I'm sorry our robust grilling was perceived as rude. I think all of us here have a huge respect for Simpsons as a a product and for small, family-run firms producing craftsmen-made items that are both useful and beautiful.

There's not enough "Simpsons" and their ilk in this world of "Made In China" injection-moulded plastic tat.

Sorry you were offended; I hope this post shows why family-firms are often painful and precarious.
 
If some of you think I took things too personally, I hope you understand that I couldn't take it any other way but that! My family tree proudly holds the name 'Simpson'. Alex was part of my family and is part of my own heritage. So much so I was christened with the name Gary Alexander Young (yes the initials GAY did cause me some issues during my school days!) after my Great Uncle. My mum and dad's original house in Nimmer was called Mancarella - from the names Mandy (MAN), my oldest sister, Carol (CAR) my middle sister, and Ella (ELLA!) Great Uncle Alex's wife.
When people, who obviously have a passion for Simpson brushes, cast opinions from 'the outside looking in' it is easy to make conclusions. Yes, I agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinions but please bear in mind that I was not on the outside looking in, I was living the business and know first hand the reasons why. Everyone using this site apart from me can only make assumptions (as researched as thoroughly as can be). Even David Carter does not hold all the information and he originally took over the business from the family in 1990!

Can we draw a line under this? Safe to say I know that Simpsons (and Coate's) were a unique company when we owned them. I am very proud of the name and I am very proud to be part of the history.

I will answer any question on here as straightforwardly as I can. But it is difficult being questioned/queried about any answer I give when I was 'actually there on the ground'!
 
With a line drawn under it I have a question, which shapes of brushes did your father, grandfather and great grandfather favour and use as their day to day brush?
 
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